Temporary Change in Spire Schedule, Gate timer and reward adjustments

[Deleted User - 1178646]

Time Warp affecting Spire cooldown would be cool Polar Bear too.

And I think people don't play spire to the top because it's so freaking expensive. We have 25 active people and one guy goes to the top most weeks because he is a loon. 5-10 might complete level 1 and the rest barely make it past gate 1. Nerfing timer gates isn't going to change that.

Guess I should rename my guild then, The Looney Tunes it is

Spoiler

Just becouse someone likes the tower doesn't make him a loon.
If I was him I would seek out a fellowship that does appriciate him more .

 

[KarlD]

Time Warp affecting Spire cooldown would be cool Polar Bear too.

And I think people don't play spire to the top because it's so freaking expensive. We have 25 active people and one guy goes to the top most weeks because he is a loon. 5-10 might complete level 1 and the rest barely make it past gate 1. Nerfing timer gates isn't going to change that.

While you think it's loony to do the Spire there are others like myself who think it's loony NOT to do the Spire. Each week I gain hundreds of diamonds, around 200 hours of time instants, bunches of CC spells and spell fragments, portal profits, supply and coin instants, the occasional magic house or workshop. and various other buildings. Those time instants I use to create enough troops to fight through the Spire plus a lot of the tournament as well.

I think many people hate the Spire because they don't quite get that doing the Spire is an investment in doing even more of the Spire. They get through those first three gates, which are trivial for anybody and they win 7*5hr time boosters. They then squander them on finishing upgrading some building. Or maybe they leave them in inventory and don't think about them again. Then they get to a fight that cost them troops that will take them 15 hours to replace and think that's a ridiculously expensive fight. They don't realize that they won 35 hours of time boosts that could be used to instantly replace those troops. Yes, the Spire is expensive in troops, but Inno gives you everything you need to pay for it. They give you supply instants to help pay for training the troops. They give CC spells and Spell Fragments to go craft military boost buildings or more supply instants. They give you diamonds to help pay for the occasional times when you need to negotiate. They give you Magic Workshops (if you are very lucky) to help pay for training troop and Dwarven Armorers to make it easier to fight your way through. Then as you progress further you get more and more of all the above that you invest in getting even further still until your entire fs is doing the entire Spire and you're all swimming in time boosters and diamonds and Magic buildings.

So go back and convince your fs to try putting everything they win in the Spire into their Spire account. If you win time instants think of them as being intended specifically for training troops for the Spire. If you win diamonds think of them as being intended specifically for negotiating in the Spire. Do the same with supply instants. If you win spells and fragments then use them to craft things like supply instants or military boosts buildings that will help get through the Spire. It won't seem so expensive when you realize you are just using things the Spire already gave you.

 

[Deleted User - 1178646]

Thats how I convinced and got my guild exited about the spire,

When the multiplayer feature of the spire came out I made a document that we distributed throughout the guild named: "how to play the spire for free"
And there is a joke and expression in english about "Going Dutch" we like free stuff

It included a troop calculator.
This resulted in the above result
Currently we are 7 points short from another total finish, an easy target so we are a happy bunch.

So we don't mind this change as we on average get a tiny fraction more "free stuff".

A similar problem existedwhen tournaments came out, it took a while of explaining how you could benefit from it, not everyone noticed how you could benefit from the tournaments. but once you explained and showed it properly the entousiasm came naturally.

 

[Ashrem]

Just becouse someone likes the tower doesn't make him a loon.

Faulty logic. Saying someone does "X" because they are "A" does not imply everyone who does "X" is "A".

 

[Enevhar Aldarion]

And there is a joke and expression in english about "Going Dutch" we like free stuff

I guess you do not know what that phrase has meant for a long time in the US. Going Dutch means two people go on a date and each pays for themselves, but not the other person, the way a normal date goes. So nothing is free when Going Dutch. And it has never been a joke. Women tend to choose this option when they are not sure about the guy and don't want to feel like she owes him anything after the date.

 

[Deleted User - 1178646]

Guess it has a different meaning in different parts of the world.
I don't live in the US so only know the meaning of the wordt from others around the world.

 

[Ashrem]

I'm not aware of any native english speakers who thinks it has anything to do with getting stuff free. I've only ever seen it used as splitting the cost.

 

[Deleted User - 3932582]

Completely offtopic, but while "going Dutch" always meant splitting something (usually a meal), it was likely coined by the English several hundred years ago as a derogatory term for being cheap. If English customs at the time were that you were supposed to pay for the whole meal in full, going Dutch would mean that you'd be getting half of that for free

 

[Deleted User - 1178646]

That's one problem, it happens but there is no way of knowing what influences it in what way, so one can't adapt ones strategy unless by not doing anything anymore, so it basically is a slotmachine. I did not unlock any new squadsizes, and at the end of the tree for a while no other research has been unlocked either. So it might have something to do with me jumping to the next tier due to upgrading AWs, but in that case the jump is ridiculous.
Just finished the first tower, with about 60% more losses than usual, despite the firephoenix being active and a UUU active, mostly because the bloody squadsize now is so large even in the first part of that tower that any loss is horrendous, let alone in this second one.
So for this week I'm done. Even on manual fighting I can't get through this one, so I burned 5x5 TOWER squads in my 1 auto-battle and 4 manual attempts in this encounter. With a towersquad being just over 4 regular squads that means that this single encounter already cost me more than 100 squads of troops.
I don't mind a challenge, but this just pisses me off royally, especially since I'm not even getting close to winning.
And no, I'm not some newbe at manual fighting choosing the wrong troops, I fight 95% of my tourneybattles and usually do 20+ provinces for 5 rounds and never burn that many troops in the entire tourney.
And I don't 'convince' out of principle because that is just like playing roulette and I HATE that random bs for huge amounts of (sentient) goods.

@alainemk
Playing the Spire as individual is not worth it period, except for maybe the 1st 2 levels of the first tower. I only started really playing the Spire when the FS awards were introduced since they made up for the huge cost. (except that this week I'm just screwed apparently).

If you really want a challeng you can always try to battle with a SS like this:

I am not that foolhardy and rather pick my poison and negotiate lol

 

[Xelenia]

Let stay on topic We can open a lounge conversation and have a whole discussion on word play meanings

 

[DeletedUser19458]

If I was him I would seek out a fellowship that does appriciate him more .

Ease up guys, just being facetious

Point of post was that I do not believe gate timers are blocking spire participation.

 

[GlamDoll]

The cost to benefit ratio is still NOT worth my time & energy...I do the first gate & move along. I already have more than enough 'work-to-do' in RL. Not to say anything about the virus that is killing people globally.

 

[KarlD]

A similar problem existedwhen tournaments came out, it took a while of explaining how you could benefit from it, not everyone noticed how you could benefit from the tournaments. but once you explained and showed it properly the entousiasm came naturally.

Convincing people of the value of tournaments is a lot harder I'd imagine since the benefits are not as directly felt. For instan

That's one problem, it happens but there is no way of knowing what influences it in what way, so one can't adapt ones strategy unless by not doing anything anymore, so it basically is a slotmachine. I did not unlock any new squadsizes, and at the end of the tree for a while no other research has been unlocked either. So it might have something to do with me jumping to the next tier due to upgrading AWs, but in that case the jump is ridiculous.
Just finished the first tower, with about 60% more losses than usual, despite the firephoenix being active and a UUU active, mostly because the bloody squadsize now is so large even in the first part of that tower that any loss is horrendous, let alone in this second one.
So for this week I'm done. Even on manual fighting I can't get through this one, so I burned 5x5 TOWER squads in my 1 auto-battle and 4 manual attempts in this encounter. With a towersquad being just over 4 regular squads that means that this single encounter already cost me more than 100 squads of troops.
I don't mind a challenge, but this just pisses me off royally, especially since I'm not even getting close to winning.
And no, I'm not some newbe at manual fighting choosing the wrong troops, I fight 95% of my tourneybattles and usually do 20+ provinces for 5 rounds and never burn that many troops in the entire tourney.
And I don't 'convince' out of principle because that is just like playing roulette and I HATE that random bs for huge amounts of (sentient) goods.

I think it's probably not a great principle never to convince because I think Inno has it set up that you really should sometimes. I've certainly had multiwave encounters where I couldn't see any combination of troops that worked for all 3 waves and because the SS is so huge I don't even want to try. Also I rarely cater in general so I gotta spend my goods on something. However, I've found that it often does pay to at least scout it because sometimes I find they are all stuck behind a wall and what looks barely winnable at best can suddenly turn into zero or minimal losses with the right selection of troops.

I don't think it's accurate to compare convincing to roulette. Roulette is random and your statistical expectation is the same no matter how you bet. But it very much matters how you select goods when convincing. If you are just randomly placing goods until you get it right then I can see why you would be against the process.

One thing I never do in a multiwave encounter is autofight, especially when the SS is huge. Autofight can do some bizarre things that can cost a lot of troops. The more troops I lose in the first wave the worse it will be in subsequent waves. There really aren't that many encounters in the Spire so it's well worth spending a little extra time to manual fight when so many troops are at stake.

 

[Enevhar Aldarion]

One thing I never do in a multiwave encounter is autofight, especially when the SS is huge. Autofight can do some bizarre things that can cost a lot of troops. The more troops I lose in the first wave the worse it will be in subsequent waves. There really aren't that many encounters in the Spire so it's well worth spending a little extra time to manual fight when so many troops are at stake.

I had extra time this week and I completed all three floors of the Spire and fought all 48 encounters and did them all using auto-fight. And that was browser, not mobile, so I was not limited to auto-fight. I did not have to redo any of the fights and the small increase in troop loss by using auto-fight is not a big deal for me anymore. Also, I do not have as much military boost as a lot of other players. All my military AWs are between levels 6 and 11, my Fire Phoenix is only level 8 and the only military booster I put out was the Dwarven Armorer. I am really looking forward to last year's Phoenix artifacts coming up next week, so I can finally max my Fire Phoenix, though I am sure that extra 10% damage will not save that many of my troops.

 

[Deleted User - 1178646]

I had extra time this week and I completed all three floors of the Spire and fought all 48 encounters and did them all using auto-fight. And that was browser, not mobile, so I was not limited to auto-fight. I did not have to redo any of the fights and the small increase in troop loss by using auto-fight is not a big deal for me anymore. Also, I do not have as much military boost as a lot of other players. All my military AWs are between levels 6 and 11, my Fire Phoenix is only level 8 and the only military booster I put out was the Dwarven Armorer. I am really looking forward to last year's Phoenix artifacts coming up next week, so I can finally max my Fire Phoenix, though I am sure that extra 10% damage will not save that many of my troops.

You must have been insane lucky getting the right fights, as this story doesn't make any sense otherwise.

 

[Deleted User - 3932582]

You must have been insane lucky getting the right fights, as this story doesn't make any sense otherwise.

Why? He had Dwarven Armorer out. I autofight the second half of the Spire every week, with all military AWs at L11 and FP at L10, so close enough. With no health boost you may end up in a pickle in a few encounters so will need to cater there (and if you actually lose, the losses would be painful). But if I have UUU out then it almost never happens. Obviously, DA is even better in this regard.

 

[DeletedUser25390]

I agree, way to expensive.
I want a bettter chance to get the Moonstone Library, been trying to win it since the the beginning.
Also how about a different way to buy extra turns, maybe with a timer as in FOE.[Guild Expedition] without using diamonds until the 5th turn.

 

[Deleted User - 1178646]

Somehow I always see at least 1 fight like?

wave 1: hellhound, hellhound, hellhound, hellhound, mage
wave 2: mage, heavy melee, heavy melee, heavy range, heavy range

You never encounter at least 1 impossible combination?
and then we even ignore possible losses due to random maps and the crappy AI.

Am I really that unlucky?

 

[Deleted User - 1178646]

I agree, way to expensive.
I want a bettter chance to get the Moonstone Library, been trying to win it since the the beginning.
Also how about a different way to buy extra turns, maybe with a timer as in FOE.[Guild Expedition] without using diamonds until the 5th turn.

With 4 turns I never ever need to use diamonds anymore in the spire.

 

[DeletedUser25516]

I get it this game needs to be profitable to the owners, but rather than take away from it to do so why not add more competition to motivate the big spenders into getting the edge, i spent a couple of years over on foe and know how much certain individuals spend to have the edge on other players, it was a well balanced and what looked like a very profitable system, ive been here a few months and it seems like you guys are struggling for profits, when i saw the buy badges sale in the adventure thing it seemed to be the writing on the wall, just add some arena system or something where people or fs could compete to be the best and problems will be solved