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    Your Elvenar Team

This is nuts!!

DeletedUser7370

Guest
Again, I'm a newer player so perhaps there are subtleties in developing my armies
First subtlety is that if you do not have all 5 unit type, then you should not even use fighting. Once you do have access to all 5 types then you can build up a force and fight.
Next is what is often referred to as the goldilocks zone. No one can give a perfect definition of where that is, but earlier in the game we can say you are very likely outside of the zone if you have scouted more than is required to open the chest at the start of the next chapter. This zone is really defined by the squad size ratio between you and the provincial troops.
The only thing after is troop selection. Many guides go into great detail, but if you followed the 2 things above then it can be reduced to simple point system counting game. Such a simple system allows combat to rapidly be completed with the auto-fight option and maintains a high 99% win rate, although it tends to suffer higher troop loss then more complex selections and manual fighting.
 

DeletedUser4790

Guest
1. The "game" typically gets the initiative
Only in provinces where you are facing Mist Walkers and Rangers will the enemies have an advantage on initiative. For all the other provinces it pretty much goes both ways.

3. The initial placement of my troops in the battle view always places my troops in the most awkward position preventing initial movements for strategic placement and I have not been able to figure out any logic between the selection of troops in the "fight" menu that translates to initial positioning in the battle view.
The first fighter you select is always placed in the middle, the second fighter to his left, the third to his right, the fourth at the top of the screen and the fifth and the bottom of the screen. Placing you fighters in the best possible position can make a huge difference in almost every fight.

4. When I "shortcut' by clicking my 'enemy' target it seems the game automatically always moves my troops to the most disadvantageous physical position blocking my other troops or allowing range units to 'escape' my blocking troops.
True indeed, I always place my troops where I want them when attacking the enemies, the game will almost always place them in bad spots.

5. It appears the game typically has an advantage in "damage" and "hits"
6. I am always facing troops that are "hard" or "very hard" <- is this it for the rest of the game, I will always be at the disadvantage?
This only happens when the enemy has larger squads than the player. It is advisable to scout only the amount of provinces needed to unlock the next chapter in the research tree. The cost for fighting and negotiating to complete a province will increase with each newly scouted province. If a player stays within the number of provinces necessary to unlock the next chapters chest, most of the fights will be on a medium difficulty level or under, with maybe just a one or two hard provinces.

7. Often the game is missing the 'lines' defining the movement hexagonals or my troops are invisible in the battle view
A quick refresh of the game will almost always fix that problem. If you find you are having this issue more often than not, you may need to clear your browser's cache or try a different browser.
 
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DeletedUser9399

Guest
Only in provinces where you are facing Mist Walkers and Rangers will the enemies have an advantage on initiative. For all the other provinces it pretty much goes both ways.


The first fighter you select is always placed in the middle, the second fighter to his left, the third to his right, the fourth at the top of the screen and the fifth and the bottom of the screen. Placing you fighters in the best possible position can make a huge difference in almost every fight.


True indeed, I always place my troops where I want them when attacking the enemies, the game will almost always place them in bad spots.



This only happens when the enemy has larger squads than the player. It is advisable to scout only the amount of provinces needed to unlock the next chapter in the research tree. The cost for fighting and negotiating to complete a province will increase with each newly scouted province. If a player stays within the number of provinces necessary to unlock the next chapters chest, most of the fights will be on a medium difficulty level or under, with maybe just a one or two hard provinces.


A quick refresh of the game will almost always fix that problem. If you find you are having this issue more often than not, you may need to clear your browser's cache or try a different browser.

Thank you for taking the time to address my issues.
I also found another post where I see I have grown past the recommended provinces for my current level - by stopping my "world" expansions until it balances I should resolve being behind in army strength and also catch up on squad size and finally, I need to research AW's to "strengthen" my armies.
 

Ashrem

Oh Wise One
In the early game, your troop choices are limited, which can be frustrating.
1. The "game" typically gets the initiative
See below for more on initiative
2. The layout of the province is also typically laid out to favor the disposition of "game" forces
That depends on your troop choices.
3. The initial placement of my troops in the battle view always places my troops in the most awkward position preventing initial movements for strategic placement and I have not been able to figure out any logic between the selection of troops in the "fight" menu that translates to initial positioning in the battle view.
See below for how the troops are positioned.
4. When I "shortcut' by clicking my 'enemy' target it seems the game automatically always moves my troops to the most disadvantageous physical position blocking my other troops or allowing range units to 'escape' my blocking troops.
The AI is not very bright, which can be an advantage if you fight manually.
5. It appears the game typically has an advantage in "damage" and "hits"
Depends on the rating of the province.
6. I am always facing troops that are "hard" or "very hard" <- is this it for the rest of the game, I will always be at the disadvantage?
This relates to how far you've scouted. You may find lots of references to "overscouting" and "Goldilocks zone" on the forums. The more you've scouted ahead, the difficult the enemies. It's intended by the devs to control your rate of expansion vs progress in the tech tree. If you go to your tech tree and hover over the scouting chest for the next chapter, you'll see how many provinces you need to finish to advance. if you go over that in early chapters, you will find fighting terribly hard until you "catch up" by mid-late chapters, you can be 10 or more over without too much trouble.
7. Often the game is missing the 'lines' defining the movement hexagonals or my troops are invisible in the battle view
If you re-load the browser window, the system will warn you that you have a fight in progress and ask if you want to finish it, then step through any actions you've taken so far so you can continue from where you stopped.

Perhaps I need to understand the "finer" points of "combat" but it seems pretty straight forward - and if there are subtleties I'm missing - why is it so complicated? If the 'battle' option is discouraged by making it grossly weighted in favor of the game, then why include it?

Perhaps I should work on understanding my troop preparation better, but again - in the game flow, acquiring the "assets (buildings & foreign troops)" to "power up" my troops seems like I will be in a lag time and constantly "catching up" making me the "designated" loser by default. Again, I'm a newer player so perhaps there are subtleties in developing my armies or perhaps there is a game flow where you go through a growth phase before catching up - I don't know, guess i'll find out.
There is some info on the wiki, and are several guides to combat available if you dig through the forums. Start by looking for guides by @Mykan and videos by @Jackluyt

Initiative:
The initiative is based on the troop's initiative. The higher numbers go first. The initiative is the final box on the troop screen when you look at them in detail
upload_2017-8-16_5-56-16.png


Troop Placement
The order your troops get put on the field is outward from the center (center, up, down, up, down):
The first troop you pick goes in the middle, the 2nd goes above that, the third goes below it, the 4th above 2nd and the 5th below 3rd. so:
4
2
1
3
5

upload_2017-8-16_5-58-17.png

upload_2017-8-16_6-3-47.png

(edit: took way too long to compose, so ninja'd, of course)
 

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Ashrem

Oh Wise One
One trick that can be useful if you have a landscape plug is that enemies won't try to get closer if they don't find a path to you. They will stop moving until a space opens up. If you can draw them into a spot where only one of them can attack one of yours, it's possible to block your openings with heavy troops and plink away at them with range, attacking each new enemy as the previous one falls.
 

DeletedUser4790

Guest
One trick that can be useful if you have a landscape plug is that enemies won't try to get closer if they don't find a path to you.
I love when that happens. or when an enemy blocks the path of all the rest but won't move. It's so much fun to pluck away at everyone else and leave him for last. lol
 

DeletedUser9551

Guest
I m a fairly new player, signed in about 3-4 months ago, and yes, i did put quite a bit of money to get where i stand now. That said, I agree, some battle has come to be too hard, no matter what type of troop I put in.

At the beginning, you can easily win with one type of troop, especially if you re fighting near your town, but as you move further away, you will need larger army , and sometime even mix the type of troops you ll need cause only 1 type wont cut it.

And let s not mix up province battle and tournament battle, they don't function the same! A province battle require your full size army, and a planned tactic, matching your enemy with your troops. A tournament battle only use the smallest size army per province and enemy type usually is restrict to one type , or sometime 2. which make fighting quite more easy.

But at my stage of the game, with my tech skills and scouting, province battle range from easy (4 area away) to very hard (6 area away). So yes you got to slow down and let tech skill catch up to where you want to be.

And if you lose a battle at medium or hard, you probably have one of those issue, 1) not enough troops, 2) you re fighting a province which is too far for your ability to fight, 3) you dont know your troops well enough and get blast.
 

Ashrem

Oh Wise One
My understanding is that there is a weak spot in the design around chapters 3 and 4 where combat is difficult (I never fight int he provinces). If you hang tough you'll get through that.
 

Sir Squirrel

Artist EXTRAORDINAIRE and Buddy Fan Club member
I read that they adjusted the number of provinces needed for early chapters to address that issue about the fights being to hard in chapter 2-3 , but you still can't scout more provinces then you need to open the chest at the beginning of the next chapter. If you scout to many to fast you will have to wait until your squad size upgrades catch up.
 

DeletedUser10507

Guest
having found this game after playing a very intensive fighting game for many years, I advance rapidly beyond my fighting capabilities here. Ironically, my RL issues caused me to slow down drastically, and my discovered provinces have dropped back from being "extremely hard" & "very hard" to merely hard & difficult, and I am beginning to win more battles. The "helps" provided by the administration have been very good and the game has become more fun, again.

So I shall end my comments with a thank you for the newer fighting and map improvements. Just my $0.02
 

DeletedUser8847

Guest
There is guides for many things except one that matters the most; How to loose fights.
Some do read those files, I do not.
I have found out that actually asking things from way older player, who has gone thru many chapters already, gives you the best advice you csn get.
Reading and actual real thing are different.
You can write a million miles long info or guide all things yet it always lacks feeling of the real thing.
Training troops and using them are sometimes different aspects of the same thing.
Why+
you can't learn your troops in the game from the mistakes they've made, you csn only learn yourself by that
 

DeletedUser9399

Guest
Fighting for expansions has become very one sided, after 288 expansion wins I can tell you the latest fighting is way out of balance. Terrain is problem enough so sometimes it is best to negotiate but enemies have higher hit points and are able to take a hit far better than my strongest fighters

I agree, the combat is truly weighted in the games favor to a degree that is not defensible.
Should not be this hard - I don't mind losing, just not losing every single time - that's really messed up fellas.
 

DeletedUser9399

Guest
I agree, the combat is truly weighted in the games favor to a degree that is not defensible.
Should not be this hard - I don't mind losing, just not losing every single time - that's really messed up fellas.

The layout is set up to optimize the strengths of the defending (games) combatants every time. One suggestion to work wonders - just make the layout random so it is FAIR - does not favor the game or the players - is random.
 

mucksterme

Oh Wise One
The layout is set up to optimize the strengths of the defending (games) combatants every time. One suggestion to work wonders - just make the layout random so it is FAIR - does not favor the game or the players - is random.

Or, what has been suggested before, let us see the battlefield before choosing our troops.
That would help.
Better yet, let us place our troops ourselves.
 

DeletedUser9399

Guest
Or, what has been suggested before, let us see the battlefield before choosing our troops.
That would help.
Better yet, let us place our troops ourselves.

I'm not advocating to change the advantage from the game to the player. My suggestion is to remove the unfair advantage all together - it's not right to hedge the "house" bet. I hope they are listening. Fair request for a fair playing field.
 

DeletedUser9399

Guest
Only in provinces where you are facing Mist Walkers and Rangers will the enemies have an advantage on initiative. For all the other provinces it pretty much goes both ways.


The first fighter you select is always placed in the middle, the second fighter to his left, the third to his right, the fourth at the top of the screen and the fifth and the bottom of the screen. Placing you fighters in the best possible position can make a huge difference in almost every fight.


True indeed, I always place my troops where I want them when attacking the enemies, the game will almost always place them in bad spots.



This only happens when the enemy has larger squads than the player. It is advisable to scout only the amount of provinces needed to unlock the next chapter in the research tree. The cost for fighting and negotiating to complete a province will increase with each newly scouted province. If a player stays within the number of provinces necessary to unlock the next chapters chest, most of the fights will be on a medium difficulty level or under, with maybe just a one or two hard provinces.


A quick refresh of the game will almost always fix that problem. If you find you are having this issue more often than not, you may need to clear your browser's cache or try a different browser.

Are you a developer for the game?
How do you know so much detail, especially if you, as stated under your avatar - are a "new" player.
Don't you think the game should be written to be playable and fair for` the average player? Not those with an inside advantage by understanding the code and business rules?

I listened to your explanations and have attempted to implement your advice and frankly am very disappointed by what I see as unbalanced play in the games favor and what appears to be a - we don't give a "shoot" attitude by a group of player insiders (perhaps developers). Also their appears to be a negative attitude towards players who use diamonds - aren't players who "pay" for diamonds by their contributions helping support the continuity of the game and those who "work" on the game?

Plus a bug is a bug. Why should I have to "refresh" the game to work around what is obviously a "known" issue like the graphic problems with the battle layout. I'm not just complaining, I hope you see my comments as legitimate questions about some areas which could be improved to balance game play and make it a more enjoyable experience for players. I would appreciate using combat instead of having to rely pretty much exclusively on negotiating.
 

SoggyShorts

Mathematician par Excellence
Are you a developer for the game?
How do you know so much detail, especially if you, as stated under your avatar - are a "new" player.
"new player" just means new to posting on the forums, or rarely posting on forums. The vast majority of players don't post on the forums, but a lot of players do read them.
nomar.png
Here are some of the guides floating around the forums:

https://en.wiki.elvenar.com/index.php?title=Battle
http://crazywizard.info/en/bb_the_basics.html
https://us.forum.elvenar.com/index.php?threads/mykans-guide-fighting-guide.4205/
 

DeletedUser9399

Guest
And on top of what Moisty said, your status also says "new player."
Does that mean we should discount anything you say?

Did you read what I wrote?
I wasn't discounting what was said with that comment - I was questioning his depth of knowledge as a "new player".
Soggy Shorts addressed this as "new player" doesn't necessarily mean "new to the game" it could mean "new to the forum".

Seems to be some thin skin and defensiveness here which is why I'm thinking developers frequent this forum.
Users are typically more objective about software and it's performance, strengths and weaknesses.
Developers can tend to be a bit defensive interpreting feedback as personal attacks.

I'm a software tester by profession.
If my comments are offensive to forum members, I'll stop posting.

Best Regard - no hard feelings :)
 

mucksterme

Oh Wise One
Seems to be some thin skin and defensiveness ..................................
....................................................
...................................................
If my comments are offensive to forum members, I'll stop posting.


oh
ok
 
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